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Catholics 'ignore rules on sex' |
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 Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 2:08 pm |
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| Gabe Oy |
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| Joined: 20 May 2008 |
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12th January
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| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 2:23 pm |
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| Dove |
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| Joined: 02 Sep 2007 |
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5/4/1966
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You'll find more here: http://www.thetablet.co.uk/articles/11769/ though there's quite a bit that isn't clear from the way the results are presented.
This was also covered as the first item on today's Sunday programme.
What is absolutely shocking (if it is right) and very sad is that mass-going Catholics use the morning after pill (which will be abortificiant in some women who take it) twice as much as the national average (for age-matched groups).
There are two responses to this finding: (1) strengthen the Church's teaching against all contraception, or (2) officially allow contraception and make it very clear which methods are prevent conception (condom, cap, sterilisation), which rely primarily on post-conception rejection of the fertilised egg (coil, morning after pill) and which have mixed and proad effects (the pill).
It won't surprise people to find I am in the second group (with much more open discussion on this issue, as the Church prefers simply to keep quiet most of the time rather than engage in real debate), but I have to admit to being shcoked at the rate of use of morning-after pill and so do have some sympathy with those who say weak catechesis is a prime cause of this. |
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| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 3:16 pm |
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| Sarniajoy |
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| Joined: 19 Jul 2008 |
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00.00.00
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| I thought the morning after pill only worked before the egg had implanted in the uterus, so it is not technically an abortion. I am all for the use of it myself, far better to stop the process before it gets started rather than having an abortion further down the line, imo. |
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| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 3:28 pm |
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| Dove |
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| Joined: 02 Sep 2007 |
Posts: 4841
5/4/1966
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| Sarniajoy wrote: | | I thought the morning after pill only worked before the egg had implanted in the uterus, so it is not technically an abortion. I am all for the use of it myself, far better to stop the process before it gets started rather than having an abortion further down the line, imo. |
Well, this gets us into a "hot potato" topic!
I can only offer a personal view.....
The Church over the centuries has changed its teachings on when "life" should be considered to begin - there was a time it was thought life began at the quickening (~16-18 weeks - but of course you know that from personal experience!). The teaching now is that it occurs at fertilisation.
But, for me, JP-II said something key when he talked about pro-life issues generally and said that if there is any doubt then we should always give the benefit of the doubt towards life. In Catholic teaching all life is equal - we are not to judge whether we consider a life "valuable enough". No-one needs to earn a right to life - we don't need to be of a certain ability, age, weight, etc.
So, personally, I'm not certain of the point that life begins (except we should not imagine there are souls in heaven waiting to be born). So in that uncertainty I'm very happy to adopt the precautionary "choose life" approach.
Michael |
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Last edited by Dove on Sun Jul 27, 2008 3:55 pm; edited 5 times in total |
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| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 3:50 pm |
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| The Lords way. |
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| Joined: 18 Aug 2007 |
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24th Sept
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Then there is the question:
Should you be having sex with someone whom you would not love them enough to have a child with them ? ( I do not mean avoid conttraception and just see what happens.  ) Too many women trap men and it is wrong. The same vice versa men with women.
My friends neice was in a relationship and had become pregnant. Her ex-boyfriend then asked her back and she aborted the baby. 
Then ran off to be with her ex-partner. Human beings whether Catholic need to be responsible about whom they are sleeping with and need a little more than a sexual urge as a reason for having sex.
I would prefer my daughter or Son to bring their partner home than have sex in the street or in unsafe places. I also believe contraception is a must when neither at the stage where they want children.
The Catholic church is wrong to tell people not to use contraceptives.
I am a christian but children when adults have to live and make their own decisions. Whilst they may know how I feel and live, they have to make their own decisions and take the consequences for those decisions.
If I said anything amiss, it;'s sunstroke, thats my excuse and I am sticking to it.. 
Love Lynne,xx   |
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_________________
 Isaiah 54:17 (King James Version)17.(a)No weapon that is formed against thee shall prosper; and every tongue that shall rise against thee in judgment thou shalt condemn. |
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| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 4:24 pm |
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| The Lords way. |
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| Joined: 18 Aug 2007 |
Posts: 9319
24th Sept
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| Dove wrote: | | Sarniajoy wrote: | | I thought the morning after pill only worked before the egg had implanted in the uterus, so it is not technically an abortion. I am all for the use of it myself, far better to stop the process before it gets started rather than having an abortion further down the line, imo. |
Well, this gets us into a "hot potato" topic!
I can only offer a personal view.....
The Church over the centuries has changed its teachings on when "life" should be considered to begin - there was a time it was thought life began at the quickening (~16-18 weeks - but of course you know that from personal experience!). The teaching now is that it occurs at fertilisation.
But, for me, JP-II said something key when he talked about pro-life issues generally and said that if there is any doubt then we should always give the benefit of the doubt towards life. In Catholic teaching all life is equal - we are not to judge whether we consider a life "valuable enough". No-one needs to earn a right to life - we don't need to be of a certain ability, age, weight, etc.
So, personally, I'm not certain of the point that life begins (except we should not imagine there are souls in heaven waiting to be born). So in that uncertainty I'm very happy to adopt the precautionary "choose life" approach.
Michael |
The egg is living material before fertalisation and the sperm is certainly a living organism because it swims to get to the egg.
I just wonder which I was, the egg or the sperm?
If women carry the female dna then the sperm must be the one who decides the sex. So I guess I was the female sperm who beat all the males and the other females to get to the ova first.
I was the one who said I was first out of millions and some sod put it on the tv advert when it was my saying. One in a million is something we all have in common.
I should sue for royalties. 
Love Lynne.xx |
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_________________
Isaiah 54:17 (King James Version)17.(a)No weapon that is formed against thee shall prosper; and every tongue that shall rise against thee in judgment thou shalt condemn. |
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| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 8:00 pm |
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| Dove |
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| Joined: 02 Sep 2007 |
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| (as this is general interest I shall move it to All Faiths) |
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| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 8:12 pm |
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| Gabe Oy |
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| Joined: 20 May 2008 |
Posts: 1050
12th January
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| Sarniajoy wrote: | | I thought the morning after pill only worked before the egg had implanted in the uterus, so it is not technically an abortion. I am all for the use of it myself, far better to stop the process before it gets started rather than having an abortion further down the line, imo. |
It's believed the morning-after pill (Levonelle) works by preventing your ovaries from releasing an egg and also alters the lining of the womb, so a fertilised egg can't embed itself there. |
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| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 8:18 pm |
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| Gabe Oy |
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| Joined: 20 May 2008 |
Posts: 1050
12th January
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| The Lords way wrote: | | The egg is living material before fertalisation and the sperm is certainly a living organism because it swims to get to the egg. 9 |
I think that sperm is counted more as a cell, than it is an organism. (as is the female egg)
| Quote: | | I just wonder which I was, the egg or the sperm? |
Well you are a combination of the two |
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| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 8:20 pm |
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| Dove |
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| Joined: 02 Sep 2007 |
Posts: 4841
5/4/1966
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Yes - If an egg has been released and is then fertilised after intercourse then these drugs prevent the uterus from maintaining the pregnancy. They block the action of progesterone - which as the name applies is a pro-gestational hormone required for the uterus to maintain the preganancy.
The Catholic objection is that an egg may have been fertilised and this is then denied the possibility (assuming everything else is OK and it would be a normal healthy pregnancy) of continuing its "life". It is sad, therefore, to see so many Catholics using this type of mechanism which is not really contraceptive.
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